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View Full Version : Are Sportspersons less iconic these days?



scotsirishwithswagga
06-13-2010, 12:21 PM
Just been thinking about this a lot recently, i am a big football fan(soccer) and when i was thinking back on some of my team's ( Glasgow Celtic) players over the year modern players just seem less iconic, same goes for boxing and lots of other sports.

What's causing it? the massive wages? fame? overkill? or just a general public apathy?

for my parts sports seem to be getting more and more artificial with less of the common man on the street being represented and pollitics becoming more removed from sports i.e. Ali representing african americans or celtic player's being supporters who grew up in the stadiums watching there predecessors e.g.:

* My team won the european cup with a team made up of locals (no further than 30 miles from the stadium)

* players used to be from working class areas and they would stay around there for most of their lives i.e. Tommy Burns, Jimmy Johnston, Tommy Coyne etc.

* Players used to break the mould from time to time i.e. Ian Wright and Jimmy Bullard were discovered while playing part-time and working on building sites.

Is this just me but i sometimes think will we really be here in 30 years time discussing Pac, Floyd, Kobe, Beckham in the same way we discuss Ali, Frazer, Jordan or Pele?

imported_Mr Burke
06-14-2010, 03:19 PM
Just been thinking about this a lot recently, i am a big football fan(soccer) and when i was thinking back on some of my team's ( Glasgow Celtic) players over the year modern players just seem less iconic, same goes for boxing and lots of other sports.

What's causing it? the massive wages? fame? overkill? or just a general public apathy?

for my parts sports seem to be getting more and more artificial with less of the common man on the street being represented and pollitics becoming more removed from sports i.e. Ali representing african americans or celtic player's being supporters who grew up in the stadiums watching there predecessors e.g.:

* My team won the european cup with a team made up of locals (no further than 30 miles from the stadium)

* players used to be from working class areas and they would stay around there for most of their lives i.e. Tommy Burns, Jimmy Johnston, Tommy Coyne etc.

* Players used to break the mould from time to time i.e. Ian Wright and Jimmy Bullard were discovered while playing part-time and working on building sites.

Is this just me but i sometimes think will we really be here in 30 years time discussing Pac, Floyd, Kobe, Beckham in the same way we discuss Ali, Frazer, Jordan or Pele?

Nice thread, good question. I was thinking the same thing, was writing something about that and sum up of my research is - media overload.

All those things you said are just something that may add to alienation, but true reason legends are not made today is because we have too much information about everything.

What do I mean, here is example. In early seventies, you'd have 3-4 channels per television and had radio and papers for other media. On television, you had news channel, entertainment channel and sports channel.

So, if you are football fan, but there is big basketball game on TV, you'd watch it as sports fan. For example, when Maccabi and Varese played finals of the european final for in '72 in Belgrade, that game was watched by 4 milion Israelis, wich was majority of that nation population. And Maccabi campaign was past time of whole nation.

Today, they don't give a shit, since there are so much more things to come by.

While today you have hundreds of channels, PPVs and of course internet as source of information and endless pool of downloading games. You can have all the football you like. After you finish with your national championship, Champions league, Europa Cup, you can start browsing other national championship and never get anything but football. And not only you would not know sportsmen from other sport, you would become overfed with information and games and not get so excited as people before.

When I was growing up, we use to live from weekend to weekend and watch one game live and coverage of the day in the evening on TV. And talk about it till next domestic or european match. And thats the way legends were made.

It's like this not only in sports, but in movies and music. Can you name one true real Hollywood acting icon in past 20 years?

funishment
07-13-2010, 08:16 PM
If you ask me the really high paid money and the commercialization is one of the biggest factors what changed football in general a lot.
Local talents from all over the world has to many options to choose.
Todays players think more greedy than emotional and thankful to there base where they learned and loved things about the game.
In Portugal they make it very smart i think, they kind of save their talents with overpriced transfer fee´s like 30 millions for talents what is almost impossible to pay for a manager.
What options did you had back in the days when pretty much every club had paid about the same? Stay at your home town with your family and friends or leave for about the same money to a different place with different faces?
A football club today is more like a commercial concern than a sport club which was once to represent there homebase, people.
Clubs today mostly buy finished players and dont set there goal to built up an amateur/talent.
The definition of an iconic player to me is a guy who is representing someone the people can identify therselfs with.
Maybe someone out the gutter who made it to the top out of nothing, but today they dont have the opportunity to shine so i think they are dying slowly. Most people today dont live poor as it was between the WW´s.
Zinedine Zidane is an icon to me. He made his way from the gutter to the very top he has reached the highest goal a football player can get world champion 98 with his background an really iconic player.
Even if his very last moment on the field against Marco Materazzi will be in mind to be one of the rudest fouls it still shows something of the beginning where he is from and who he is.
I hope that the new planned uefa european license is going to help there a lot. No increase of debts, no external sponsors, no hobby playing millionaires, no overpaid players, only the own produced capital is allowed.
Let´s see than if Clubs like Real Madrid, Manchester United, Chelsea London, Hoffenheim 1899. AC Mailand and, and, and....will still be.
Maybe this is a good thing to stop this insane comparison who has the biggest check and finally it comes down to sport and talents who become icons.
Of course it has many factors but i personally think this is the mainfactor.
I hope my english wasnt that bad to understand the sense i tried to submit.

*As a Celtic Fan you should know about St. Pauli i guess. Can you imagine that this club what is swimming against the tide, totally anti mainstream, building the team most of the players from the own youth, debating with the fans in a bar after every game, the team is just like the city normal workers and this year playing in the bundesliga was bankrupt, insolvency cause they had ridicilous debts of 1.5 million :-)

E-DUBB
07-14-2010, 02:45 AM
it could just be we're older now too and as adults you dont tend to be so enamored with your favorite sports stars...

i dont know about the soccer analogies or comparions but in sports that are big here...

im sure tom brady is as big to kids as joe montana was too me...

or kobe is to some what magic was to me...

same in baseball...when i was a kid collecting cards reggie jackson,george brett and cal ripken were big but now albert pujols,derreck jeter,a-rod are just as big or bigger and will be held to just as high or higher in terms of iconic status...

im sure there is some truth to what you are saying with free agency being what it is in sports nowadays and fans not reall developing a long term "bond" like what it used to be...but todays icons will be tomorrows legends...its always been that way...