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imported_Nothingman
01-04-2010, 10:42 PM
http://static.boxrec.com/wiki/0/00/Toney.james.jpg

James "Lights Out" Toney

Amateur record:33-2, 32 KO's

IBF Middleweight Champion (1991-1992)
IBF Super Middleweight Champion (1993-1994)
IBF Cruiserweight Champion (2003)

The Ring Fighter of the Year 1991 and 2003
The Ring Comeback of the Year 2003
Boxing Writers Association of America Fighter of the Year 1991 and 2003

James Toney is a living legend and a boxing encyclopedia in his own right. One of the few "oldschool" fighters in his time, he is famed for his use of the "shoulder roll" technique. He is one of the few in history who is equally good defensively and offensively, can box and slug and is one of the best counterpunchers and inside fighters in the history of the sport as well. In other words, a great allrounder. He has fought in every division between middleweight and heavyweight and has held titles, major or minor, in all. But there was always one thing that kept him from becoming THE greatest boxer the world has ever seen and that is-lack of discipline. Ever since he left his arguably best weightclass of 168, Toney has been struggling with weight and has even come overweight to fights. That was one of the main reasons why he fell behind Roy Jones Jr and Bernard Hopkins in the p4p rankings and credibility. That and his trashtalking, at times violent public demeanor. But to his credit, he has always shown up to fight and gave his best even when he wasn't in best shape. His perhaps greatest year was 2003 when he made an astonishing comeback first by beating the IBF Cruiserweight champion Vassilly Jirov, then 31-0, and taking his first title in 9 years and then moving up to heavyweight and stopping the legend Evander Holyfield in 9 rounds. Seems like 9 is a lucky number for James? Maybe so, for in 2009 he showed up to his latest fight in best shape since that Holyfield fight and easily stopped the overmatched Matthew Greer, raising his record to 72-6-2 with 44 KOs. Will Lights Out impress again in 2010? It remains to be seen.

Notable wins:
Michael Nunn
Reggie Johnson *questionable
Merqui Sosa
Mike McCallum x2 *nr.2 post prime
Iran Barkley
Doug DeWitt *post prime
Tony Thornton
Charles Williams
Tim Littles
Adolpho Washington
Glenn Wolfe
Vassiliy Jirov
Evander Holyfield *post prime
Fres Oquendo *questionable

Notable losses:
Montell Griffin x2 *questionable
Roy Jones Jr
Drake Thadzi
Samuel Peter x2 *nr.1 questionable, nr 2 post prime

Questionable wins:
Reggie Johnson
Fres Oquendo

Questionable losses:
Montell Griffin
Samuel Peter I

Overall points evaluation:

'A' level wins:
Michael Nunn, Mike McCallum II, Reggie Johnson
'A-' level wins:
Vassiliy Jirov
'B' level wins:
Evander Holyfield, Merqui Sosa, Iran Barkley, Tony Thornton, Charles Williams, Tim Littles, Fres Oquendo, Glenn Wolfe
'B-' level wins:
Adolpho Washington, Doug DeWitt, Mike McCallum III

Points score: 6+1.5+8+1.5-8.5=8.5

Obama
01-05-2010, 12:03 AM
I'd have it like this:

'A' level wins:
Michael Nunn, Reggie Johnson, Mike McCallum I
'A-' level wins:
Tim Littles, Vassiliy Jirov
'B' level wins:
Merqui Sosa, Iran Barkley, Charles Williams, Mike McCallum II, Evander Holyfield, John Ruiz (half credit)
'B-' level wins:
Doug DeWitt, Adolpho Washington, Hasim Rahman (half credit), Fres Oquendo

Point Total: 6 + 3 + 5 + 1.75 – 8.5 = 7.25

Glenn Wolfe and Tony Thorton have to go.

imported_Nothingman
01-05-2010, 01:28 PM
I'd have it like this:

'A' level wins:
Michael Nunn, Reggie Johnson, Mike McCallum I
'A-' level wins:
Tim Littles, Vassiliy Jirov
'B' level wins:
Merqui Sosa, Iran Barkley, Charles Williams, Mike McCallum II, Evander Holyfield, John Ruiz (half credit)
'B-' level wins:
Doug DeWitt, Adolpho Washington, Hasim Rahman (half credit), Fres Oquendo

Point Total: 6 + 3 + 5 + 1.75 – 8.5 = 7.25

Glenn Wolfe and Tony Thorton have to go.
Why Thornton? He was acknowledged as a top contender in the 90's.

AllTimeGreat
01-05-2010, 07:04 PM
http://static.boxrec.com/wiki/0/00/Toney.james.jpg

James "Lights Out" Toney

Amateur record:33-2, 32 KO's

IBF Middleweight Champion (1991-1992)
IBF Super Middleweight Champion (1993-1994)
IBF Cruiserweight Champion (2003)

The Ring Fighter of the Year 1991 and 2003
The Ring Comeback of the Year 2003
Boxing Writers Association of America Fighter of the Year 1991 and 2003

James Toney is a living legend and a boxing encyclopedia in his own right. One of the few "oldschool" fighters in his time, he is famed for his use of the "shoulder roll" technique. He is one of the few in history who is equally good defensively and offensively, can box and slug and is one of the best counterpunchers and inside fighters in the history of the sport as well. In other words, a great allrounder. He has fought in every division between middleweight and heavyweight and has held titles, major or minor, in all. But there was always one thing that kept him from becoming THE greatest boxer the world has ever seen and that is-lack of discipline. Ever since he left his arguably best weightclass of 168, Toney has been struggling with weight and has even come overweight to fights. That was one of the main reasons why he fell behind Roy Jones Jr and Bernard Hopkins in the p4p rankings and credibility. That and his trashtalking, at times violent public demeanor. But to his credit, he has always shown up to fight and gave his best even when he wasn't in best shape. His perhaps greatest year was 2003 when he made an astonishing comeback first by beating the IBF Cruiserweight champion Vassilly Jirov, then 31-0, and taking his first title in 9 years and then moving up to heavyweight and stopping the legend Evander Holyfield in 9 rounds. Seems like 9 is a lucky number for James? Maybe so, for in 2009 he showed up to his latest fight in best shape since that Holyfield fight and easily stopped the overmatched Matthew Greer, raising his record to 72-6-2 with 44 KOs. Will Lights Out impress again in 2010? It remains to be seen.

Notable wins:
Michael Nunn
Reggie Johnson *questionable
Merqui Sosa
Mike McCallum x2 *nr.2 post prime
Iran Barkley
Doug DeWitt *post prime
Tony Thornton
Charles Williams
Tim Littles
Adolpho Washington
Glenn Wolfe
Vassiliy Jirov
Evander Holyfield *post prime
Fres Oquendo *questionable

Notable losses:
Montell Griffin x2 *questionable
Roy Jones Jr
Drake Thadzi
Samuel Peter x2 *nr.1 questionable, nr 2 post prime

Questionable wins:
Reggie Johnson
Fres Oquendo

Questionable losses:
Montell Griffin
Samuel Peter I

Overall points evaluation:

'A' level wins:
Michael Nunn, Mike McCallum II, Reggie Johnson
'A-' level wins:
Vassiliy Jirov
'B' level wins:
Evander Holyfield, Merqui Sosa, Iran Barkley, Tony Thornton, Charles Williams, Tim Littles, Fres Oquendo, Glenn Wolfe
'B-' level wins:
Adolpho Washington, Doug DeWitt, Mike McCallum III

Points score: 6+1.5+8+1.5-8.5=8.5





I highly doubt it. I know he fought a club fighter and was rocked in the first round, before stopping him in the 2nd. But hes talking about a switch to MMA. Was Holyfield that shot by the time Toney fought him? I thought maybe that could have moved to the 'A' level wins. I mean Holyfields work rate and power in the fight seemed to be there. His fatigue before he got stopped was because of the punishment he took, i thought.

Obama
01-06-2010, 01:56 AM
Why Thornton? He was acknowledged as a top contender in the 90's.

Because he never beat 2 people worth a damn. Ring Magazine rates C level fights, I don't.


Was Holyfield that shot by the time Toney fought him? I thought maybe that could have moved to the 'A' level wins. I mean Holyfields work rate and power in the fight seemed to be there. His fatigue before he got stopped was because of the punishment he took, i thought.

Yes, Holyfield was that far gone by then. Last person to deserve an 'A' win, and it's barely an 'A' win, against Holyfield is Lewis.

Sweet Pea
01-06-2010, 08:55 PM
Because he never beat 2 people worth a damn. Ring Magazine rates C level fights, I don't.

He beat Merqui Sosa AND Dave Tiberi (the guy who beat Toney but didn't get the D).

He lost close decisions to Steve Collins, Doug DeWitt and Chris Eubank.

I'd say he at least deserves recognition as a B- fighter.

imported_Nothingman
01-06-2010, 09:25 PM
He beat Merqui Sosa AND Dave Tiberi (the guy who beat Toney but didn't get the D).

He lost close decisions to Steve Collins, Doug DeWitt and Chris Eubank.

I'd say he at least deserves recognition as a B- fighter.
That's right. Even Toney said he was a good fighter. A worthy challenger to him.

Obama
01-07-2010, 04:01 AM
He beat Merqui Sosa AND Dave Tiberi (the guy who beat Toney but didn't get the D).

He lost close decisions to Steve Collins, Doug DeWitt and Chris Eubank.

I'd say he at least deserves recognition as a B- fighter.

Dave Tiberi has no credible wins, "beating" a 25% Toney means nothing.

The Sosa win was only a SD.

Need 2 credible wins, not 1. The one he does have isn't even strong. He basically got lucky 1 time in his career is how I see it. That's C level.